How To Start Making Money With On Line Joint Ventures With No Customers, No Products And With No Money

Bianco: I live in southern California, as well as you do, and you know southern California is probably one of the best places to live in the whole planet. It’s just incredible the lifestyle here. I’m two minutes from the ocean.

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: And I’m forty minutes from the mountains. So I can go skiing and surfing in the same day if I want to.
 

Michael: Yes.
 

Michael: For anyone who doesn’t know much about business and doesn’t even know what a joint venture is, let’s talk in kindergarten terms. What is a joint venture?
 

Bianco: People out there, stuck in a nine-to-five job. They hate it and it’s a rat race. The money comes in and the money goes out just as fast, and they can never get ahead. Joint venture marketing can allow you to break that cycle - to step away and leave all that behind and to start really living your dream. Basically here’s what a joint venture is: it’s where you get some leverage off of the trust and the credibility of either other people, or other businesses. A great example of this is everyone has seen, and is right before their very eyes, is Oprah Winfry.
 

Michael: Okay.
Bianco: She met up with Dr. Phil before he was on Oprah Winfry. He was nobody. He was struggling doing counseling for people and little businesses and he was nobody. But, as soon as Oprah brought him on the show, she transferred her credibility and trust on to him; because when Oprah brings someone on her show and says this guy is trustworthy – “This guy is great, I use this guy, I love this guy’s stuff.” Her audience, which is comprised of millions and millions and millions of unsold households, watch her religiously and want to be like Oprah. So when Oprah says “Dr. Phil is a guru. This guy can help anybody solve relationship problems. You need to listen to this guy,” all of her audience immediately said, “Well if he’s good enough for Oprah and she says he’s great, and I trust her, then he must be great.” Her ability and the trust that she has built with her audience was immediately transferred to Dr. Phil - and look what has happened with Dr. Phil.
 

Michael: That is exactly right.
 

Bianco: Now he has his own show and he is humongous. When Oprah does that and she taps him and says, “This guy is amazing and here’s his book, by the way,” what do people do? They run out, by the tens of thousands, and buy his book at the bookstore. This guy has become wealthy virtually overnight just because of his joint venture with Oprah. Guess what? Dr. Phil’s Show, from what I understand is, an Oprah Production.
 

Michael: That’s right, she produces it.
 

Bianco: So guess who gets paid on his show.
 

Michael: She does.
 

Bianco: She’s a smart business woman. She brought him on, realized that got credibility from her, and his sales went through the roof. She immediately set up the deal with him to produce his own TV Show - which is humungous already because Oprah’s audience, millions of people, were instantly leveraged to Dr. Phil’s benefit.
 

Michael: I totally see. She lent her credibility, with all her TV viewing audience over ten years, to Dr. Phil. Without that credibility it wouldn’t have worked would it?
 

Bianco: If Dr. Phil’s Show came on the air without Oprah, or if he was never on Oprah, nobody would know who he was. Nobody would trust him or care much about him. But because, like you said, Oprah has built this loyal following because of what she does. She’s spent hundreds of thousands of dollars and hundreds and thousands of man-hours putting together stories and information for her audience’s benefit. She’s spent years building that trust by giving so much value from her show that people just love her, and just everything she says is just like gold. When she taps you on the shoulder and says, “This guy is like gold too,” all that trust gets transferred immediately, without delay, right to you.
 

Michael: That’s amazing. Now that’s good for TV, let’s take the same concept of joint venture and lets say someone wants to apply this in a business type setting to generate money. Can you make money doing something similar to that?
 

Bianco: Yes. Any business - and that’s the best thing about joint ventures - any business, new or old, whether you have no money or no customers, or you’re just starting up, or your some huge forty million dollar a year corporation, anyone can use joint venture marketing to get amazing results. You can use it to drive tons of sales. You can use it to get tons of new customers. Here’s how they would do it: Let’s say for example you started a new company and you’re selling your book on CD-ROM, for example. You mentioned that you had a book you were creating.
 

Michael: So let’s say I’m selling my CD Rom, my sixty-one hours of audio information from my www.hardtofindseminars.com. I’ve got it all on a CD Rom.
 

Bianco: That is amazing. Anyone who listens to this is going to know it has amazing value. What you would do is this: you would think to yourself “Who has my prospect before they need me?” In other words, what is my prospect doing, what are they buying, what are they thinking about before they would need my CD, or before they would even want my CD? Then I have to figure out what companies actually have those prospects. For example, when people are at that level, or at the time that they want to get more information about marketing, where are they in their lives? Are they just getting into business? Are they in business? Some of them are just getting into business and they are trying to learn everything they can about marketing. Then you would say “Who has those prospects already?”
 

Michael: Right, and I’m going to leverage off of this list because I don’t have to mess with doing lead generating ,advertising, spending money on ads, spending money entering the names into a database. That’s already been done. I’m leveraging off of all the efforts of that other business, right?
 

Bianco: Exactly. There are other companies out there right now who have already spent maybe the last three or four years cultivating their customer list - and their customer list is your prospect list.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: What you need to do is find it. For example, anyone else who sells, lets say, computers, or anyone who sells office supplies. If someone is just getting into business, what are they going to do? They’re going to run out and buy offices supplies. They need a desk, a computer, a multitude of things. Well, you can tap in to those resources. Here’s a good example: People get an Internet connection. Most people who get an Internet connection - they’re not just out there looking for cartoons and jokes of the day. They are likely a new business.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: So you can use leverage off of someone who sells Internet connectivity and you could offer to do a joint venture with them - where you will get their customer names and you will e-mail a special offer to get your free CD.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: They would want to do that with you for a couple of reasons. One is that they could throw that free CD in as a bonus for someone signing up for their service. You don’t have to pay them to be your joint venture partner - you can get them to give your CD away as a free bonus to anyone who signs up for their Internet access service.
 

Michael: That’s right, what does it cost to make the CD? Fifty cents?
 

Bianco: Exactly. Now you’re tapping into a constant stream of leads that don’t cost you anything. What you could do, what I would recommend, is you would tell the company that is going to offer the CD as a bonus, that they need to pick up the dollar fifty cost, or the dollar cost, of producing the disk.
Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: That way you have zero marketing costs because you can have them contact your disk duplicating company directly to order disks so you never even have to talk to them.
 

Michael: Isn’t that a lot easier than me screwing around building an entire customer list?
 

Bianco: Yes, what most businesses fall down on is lead generation. Without having a constant flow of leads to your business, you’re out of business. You can’t survive without a continual stream of leads coming into your business and the only way most people think about getting leads is to advertise – paid advertising. The problems with paid advertising are that it’s very expensive and it’s very risky. People also make mistakes when they do their advertising - and then it costs them their whole business. They spend too much money, don’t bring back in enough money, and then they’re out of business.
 

Michael: Let me ask you this, I mean tell me if you agree with me – most businesses automatically go into that frame of mind: lead generating through advertising. They don’t even consider joint venturing do they?
 

Bianco: That’s because maybe one in a thousand businesses even knows what joint venturing is. They only know the traditional stuff they learn in business school. You see, joint venture marketing is something you won’t learn at Harvard Business School. Y you won’t learn it at Yale or any of the other Ivy League Schools. They don’t teach it.
 

Michael: Yes, you’re right. Because when I think about it, I had no idea what it was until I started studying this Jay Abraham stuff.
 

Bianco: Exactly. People who have MBNAs in marketing don’t even know this stuff.
 

Michael: And it’s such a simple thing, it’s almost obvious. Why wouldn’t you do it?
 

Bianco: Exactly. Here is another reason why it’s the best way to go to start.
 

Michael: Yes.
 

Bianco: I was playing golf with a friend of mine one day and he was talking about this guy who was a world champion long driver record holder.
 

Michael: Okay.
 

Bianco: He’s in the Guinness Book of World Records. He has the longest drive at tee level, and I’ll tell you in a second why that’s important, but he has the longest drive recorded at tee level… four hundred and twenty-six yards or something like that.
 

Michael: Okay.
 

Bianco: That is over four football fields.
 

Michael: Was he doing it when you guys were playing golf?
 

Bianco: When we were playing golf he hit a four hundred yard drive.
 

Michael: Then what?
 

Bianco: This guy has two records, and we were talking about his background and what he does. He mentioned that he developed a club that was called the Peace Missile Driver, and that the Peace Missile Driver was made from real decommissioned nuclear missile metal. I thought, “Hey that’s pretty interesting, I’d like to see that club.” So the next time we got together, he brought one and we checked it out. We played with it and I was pretty impressed with the club. Then he dropped the bombshell on me. He said, “You know what, Bianco? We actually had this thing tested against the top clubs - the biggest brand name.” I won’t mention the name, but it’s one of the biggest brand names out there in golf.
 

Michael: Yes.
 

Bianco: “…And we tested it. We paid a company that does the testing. We put it on a machine called Iron Byron. The Iron Byron is a mechanical hitting device that is calibrated so you can set all of the adjustments to the swing speed and angles and so you can get exact scientific measurements on every performance. They tested it against the top brand name clubs and it equaled them in distance, accuracy, and everything.” This club was amazing. They raised money, over three hundred thousand dollars to start this company to sell this club. Right away what did they do? They had all this money, too much money to spend, and they went out and starting running ads and doing different campaigns and marketing and blowing through their money faster then they even realized. They basically realized they were not getting results and they went out of business.
 

Michael: Really?
 

Bianco: They had six thousand clubs produced in inventory that they had paid for in cash.
 

Michael: Here in America?
 

Bianco: Here in America - and they went out of business.
 

Michael: Did he end up telling you that he’s sitting on six thousand clubs?
 

Bianco: They were sitting on six thousand clubs and I saw an opportunity there. I said, “You know, with the right kind of marketing - with joint venture marketing - I could sell those clubs and I could help make this thing fly.” Basically we tried to put a deal together right there and it turned out that he never finished paying the manufacturer for the clubs.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: So he didn’t really own them. Here’s what happened: I got him to send a letter to the manufacturer saying “Dispose of the clubs however you want because I can’t pay you for the clubs.” Then, basically the manufacturer got a hold of me and said, “Hey, can you help me unload these clubs because I’m a manufacturer. I don’t know how to sell clubs at retail and I don’t know what to do to get rid of these clubs. I have a huge expense with these clubs and they are taking up space and I need to get rid of them.” So I cut a deal with them. I took over that whole thing, then I set up a simple website, and then I went out and set up joint venture deals.
 

Michael: Give us the URL for that website.
 

Bianco: The URL is www.peacemissilegolf.com and that is peace like peace on earth missile m-i-s-s-i-l-e golf dot com www.peacemissilegolf.com.
 

Michael: I’ve been there, it’s a nice website. I’ve seen it.
 

Bianco: What I did is this: I said “I want to sell this club, it’s a great club, but I don’t want to take a lot of risk and I don’t want to spend a lot of money out of pocket. I think I can set up some joint venture deals with this because you can pretty much put joint venture deals together for any kind of business no matter what.” I went out on the Internet and I found about probably around two thousand other golf websites and I said “Okay, some of these are going to be good joint venture partners and some of them are not going to be worth my time.” I went and I did my research and I found one that had about three hundred thousand subscribers to their golf newsletter and I said “Okay here’s my joint venture partner.”
 

Michael: All right.
 

Bianco: I spent the next three weeks phoning them, sending them letters, e-mails, FedExing them letters, trying to get a meeting set up with them where I could explain the joint venture marketing concept and why it would be to their advantage - and the money that could be made. It basically took me three, three and half weeks, before I finally could get a phone meeting with them. Then we got on the phone and I explained it all and the Vice-President,. I was talking to him, and he said, “This sounds awesome, I love it, let me talk to the owner. I think we can go with it.” Sure enough, he called me back the next day and said that I was a go. We went ahead and sent out the endorsement, an e-mail endorsement. They wrote some information up in the endorsement about the club, a little bit about the background, and there was a link in the e-mail to my website. Well they sent it out to about fifty thousand people on their list.
 

Michael: On an e-mail list.
 

Bianco: On an e-mail list. That was our test campaign.
 

Michael: Was it buried in a newsletter or an individual mailing?
 

Bianco: It was an individual mailing - a “solo mailing,” it’s called.
 

Michael: Did you have them write it?
 

Bianco: I sent them a club. I gave them a little guidance, but I basically said, “You go check out the

product. You check it out. You write your own comments and let me know what you think about it.”
 

Michael: Okay.
Bianco: Then they sent it out and within sixteen days, we generated - just from that one e-mail - within sixteen days, when it was all said and done, twenty-two thousand dollars plus in orders for that club. Please remember that didn’t cost me a dime - I didn’t have any upfront risks, no costs, nothing. I didn’t even have to do the work, I just sat back and they did all the work.
 

Michael: That’s flipping great Bianco. How much was the club retailing for?
 

Bianco: The club retailed for two - at that time we were actually price testing it - so we were selling it, we had two different offers going and it was going for two forty-nine and it was also going for two ninety-nine.
 

Michael: All right now let’s talk. Give up the goods. What kind of deal did you work out with the manufacturer? What were you paying for the club?
 

Bianco: Hang on, Michael. Here’s the key: I managed to talk the manufacturer into drop shipping it.
 

Michael: Okay.
 

Bianco: Drop shipping it means that I get the order, I send the names to them, and they pack it and ship it to my customer. I never even touch the product.
Michael: Okay.
 

Bianco: I was paying a fraction of what they were selling it for. I don’t want to tell you the exact number, but it was a fraction of that and we both know in direct marketing to make a successful business you need to make a two to three hundred percent mark up.
 

Michael: All right, okay, you don’t have to give the exact number.
 

Bianco: There was a three hundred percent markup on it.
 

Michael: You were making three hundred percent markup?
 

Bianco: More than three hundred percent.
 

Michael: Now all right what kind of deal did you have to cut with the guy who sent the e-mail out?
 

Bianco: I told him I would pay him about twenty-five percent of the sales price.
 

Michael: So you made yourself at least a hundred and fifty bucks a club, profit in your pocket.
 

Bianco: In my pocket.
 

Michael: All right, let’s talk about setting these joint ventures up. It’s a lot of technical stuff that I always have questions about. Let me ask you this - you directed his subscribers to your website, they ordered through your website, the money came into your account, he probably had an accounting of what was going on and then did you cut him a check every week? Month? How did that work out?
 

Bianco: What you can do on the Internet now is this tracking software that you can use to track all the sales so that every time there is a sale your partner, your joint venture partner gets a little e-mail saying “Here’s another sale” so they can keep track themselves.
 

Michael: Give me the website that does the tracking software.
 

Bianco: There are hundreds of them. Some of them are good; some of them have their problems. One of the good ones is called Ground Break.
 

Bianco: www.groundbreak.com and they actually sell; they sell the software that you install on your own website. So that one is a little more technical, but you can use a service like www.ibill.com.
 

Michael: And they can do that for you?
 

Bianco: The sales will actually go through their server and you can specify how much comes to you and how much comes to your partner.
 

Michael: So specifically, that’s kind of like software for affiliates, right?
 

Bianco: Exactly.
 

Michael: Okay, so you can use it for joint ventures too?
 

Bianco: Exactly. That’s exactly what I use it for, because affiliate programs are all good and fine, but what you really want is a “super affiliate.” What is a super affiliate? It’s a joint venture partner.
 

Michael: Absolutely. Now let me ask you this, what does that software cost, if someone wants it.
 

Bianco: The Ground Break software, I think is like two hundred bucks a year for a license.
 

Michael: Okay.
 

Bianco: With Ibill, I think there is just some small set up charge like fifty to one hundred bucks.
 

Michael: All right.
 

Bianco: To get set up.
 

Michael: Now let me ask you this, did you have to sign a contract with the guy?
 

Bianco: There are no rules in marketing and there are no rules in JV, you set them up yourself. Basically the outline structure you want to use, is you want to negotiate between five to fifty percent of the gross sales price and you want just a simple letter form agreement. You don’t want a contract. You don’t want to have all this legalese in it. You just want a simple letter stating that you’re going to do this, this, and this, and in exchange for it, I’m going to pay you this, this, and this.
 

Michael: All right let me ask you this. Why gross sales not net - and what’s the difference.
 

Bianco: That’s a great question right there, because net profits - you can manipulate what the net profit is.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: And with gross sales you can do one calculation and there’s no fooling around.
 

Michael: Okay.
 

Bianco: What you want to do is just set it up. If you’re going to give fifty percent, you’re not going to give fifty of gross - because obviously that’s not your profit.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: But you want to give fifty percent of profits. You would calculate what fifty percent of profits would be and then you would calculate what that would be as a percentage of gross.
 

Michael: So you would both get a uniform agreement on what the profit is per unit and then you would structure a percentage of that profit.
 

Bianco: Exactly. There’s a simple template format and I’ll tell people in a few minutes where they can go to get something like that from my website. Basically, there’s a little simple format you use to create a letter agreement and it’s not a contract, it’s not scary - because if you send someone a scary looking legal contract, you’re never going to get any deal.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: That’s the bottom line.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: You don’t want to get into a deal with someone that you don’t trust. If you don’t trust them, if you don’t like them, if you can’t do a letter agreement and move forward comfortable, then you shouldn’t even deal with them.
 

Michael: Because no matter what, if you have an iron clad contract and someone wants to screw you, they’re going to screw you.
 

Bianco: Yes, exactly. I know personally myself. I have had fifteen page legal contracts and it still ended up costing me three hundred thousand dollars and more in bad deals that have gone south.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: And I’ve done deals where I have a simple hand shake and have made hundreds of thousands off those deals.
 

Michael: And that is really important. I would say that anyone who does go and approach joint ventures, its very important, you just have to go with your gut. You know, listen to the pit of your stomach. If you like the guy, if you trust him. You have a good sense of someone for the most part after talking to them for a short time.
 

Bianco: Exactly.
 

Michael: And you want to meet them eyeball to eyeball and you’ve just got to go with your gut, you also have to understand that not every joint venture deal is going to work and if you set up five of them and one works well, that is all you need.
 

Bianco: Exactly, one success in direct marketing, we always say, “one success makes up for seven or eight failures.”
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: And you have to understand that nobody can predict the success of anything because there are a lot of variables in marketing. Just like there are a lot of variables in life. Your goal is to go out there and do the best you can. Set up the deals the best you can and not get bogged down with the analysis paralysis, where you’re analyzing everything to the point where you’re never doing anything.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: The key to success is action.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: Action is the key to success.
 

Michael: You’ve got to put everything in motion. Let me ask you this. Let’s say I am dead broke, I don’t have ten bucks in my bank account… I don’t even have a bank account. I’ve got ten bucks in quarters in my little piggy bank and if I understand the power of joint venture and I have a telephone, and not even a computer, but I’ve got a telephone. Is it realistic that I can, with my education from what you’re going to teach, or your information product, go out there and set up a joint venture and make money from it?
Bianco: You can actually. That is a great question. You can actually not only go out and make money but you can change your life and you can get wealthy. One joint venture deal can literally make you wealthy. That’s how amazing it is.
 

Michael: Give me another example. It could be your experience or another experience, kind of like the Oprah thing, of people who have been made wealthy through joint ventures.
 

Bianco: I could spend all day giving you all of the examples of all the stuff. So let me give you a couple good ones. One example is a high end hotel. There is this high end hotel down the street here and the people who go there are couples and it’s a romantic getaway. It has Jacuzzis and everything. It has great views in the rooms. Couples getaway there to celebrate honeymoons and anniversaries, weddings, birthdays, whatever. This is not some cheesy hotel - this is expensive - three four hundred dollars a night for a room.
 

Michael: Where? Is it in LA?
 

Bianco: It’s right here in Newport Beach, California.
 

Michael: Okay.
 

Bianco: You know we’re both in beautiful sunny southern California.
 

Michael: Okay, it’s kind of rainy today.
 

Bianco: Yes, unfortunately, but you know we’ve got to live with a couple of rainy days.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: For all the good ones. The owner of this hotel - he has about fifty rooms - but he does good business and he makes great money but he’s not leveraging what he has. What he has is a customer - a high ticket purchasing customer, who has a lot of other needs, desires, and wants. So all you’ve got to do is figure out what else his customers, his patrons, would they want? They’re spending money to come and stay at this romantic getaway, what else do they want? Well I could tell you what else they may want. The husband or boyfriend, the fiancé, or whoever he is, may want to get his significant other some nice jewelry.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: So what do you do? You set up a joint venture between a jewelry store that sells high end jewelry and this hotel. The ingenious way that I developed to come up with this one would be this: you know how you have the phone in the room and you have that little blinking light when there’s a message? What we would get the owner of the hotel would do is record a little message. It’s a welcome message and it says “Hi, I’m Joe Schmoe, and I’m the owner of this hotel. I just wanted to welcome you to the hotel and I want to make sure your stay was as enjoyable as possible and I want to point out a few things so you can have the best time here. First of all, on the second floor is the gym, on the first floor is this restaurant and it features this, that, and the other. Oh, and by the way, if your thinking of doing any shopping for jewelry, my good friend owns XYZ jewelry store two blocks down. If you go in there and tell him I sent you he is going to give you a ten or fifteen” -or whatever percentage you want – let’s say fifteen percent, whatever deal you create. “Fifteen percent off any purchase you buy. So if your thinking about getting any jewelry, head down there, check it out, mention my name and you’ll get an immediate fifteen percent discount on anything you buy.”
 

Michael: Great idea.
 

Bianco: Okay, now, so every time a visitor shows up at the hotel, he goes ahead and he hits the voice-mail button to their phone. They checked in they see this message light blinking and they hit the message and hear the message. Now if they’re thinking about – if that husband or boyfriend or whoever, is thinking about buying jewelry or even if the wife or fiancé or significant other is – where are they going to go first – to that jewelry store!
Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: Now not everyone is going to go to that jewelry store and buy. That’s true, because not everyone is really interested in buying. But if he’s able to send a hundred people a week to that jewelry store, and even if ten percent of them, which would be ten people, buy a two thousand dollar product…
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: That’s twenty thousand dollars in sales a week that the hotel is now able to drive to the jewelry store - and remember, those are customers that jewelry store would never otherwise have gotten without the help of that hotel owner.
 

Michael: Right and you take a piece. You do a triangulation deal. You take a piece, the hotel takes a piece, and the jewelry store obviously gets their markup.
 

Bianco: Exactly.
 

Michael: All right, that’s exciting.
 

Bianco: So that is one way. Another is this: let’s say you make that jewelry product. Let’s say you don’t even have a jewelry store. You make this great jewelry, let’s say Australian Crystal bracelet that sell for three hundred bucks or more. You want to sell those but you don’t have any money, you only have five of them that you can afford to make and you’ve got some great pictures of them and that’s all you’ve got. So what you would do is either create a little brochure that has a one page sheet with a picture of it and a brief description of it and a way to order(a phone number a place to mail the money, what have you, or you just have a phone number to call where you go to them at the hotel and show it and sell it) and then you have the hotel owner put those in the packet with the room key so they can see it and make that special offer. You want to make a special offer.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: Because then it makes it look like you’ve cut a special deal. You’re a special deal hunter for those patrons and it makes them appreciate the fact that they’re there. You’re adding more value.
 

Michael: Okay, let’s do this. Let’s get down to some serious stuff and talk a little about mailing lists and let’s talk about specifically the resource SRDS. You’ve taught me a lot about that. Also let’s talk about how we can incorporate joint venture marketing by using the resources of the SRDS.
 

Bianco: That’s a great one. I mean for people who don’t know anything about the SRDS that is the Standard Data Rate Service or Standard Rate Data Service which is basically a huge book, its four or five inches thick, just the direct mail list one. There are actually five versions: one for advertising, one for media… We’re going to focus on the SRDS that is for direct mailing lists.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: And there are over eighty thousand mailing lists in that book that are for rent.
 

Michael: How does that book get these lists?
 

Bianco: What happens is that companies who want to rent there lists will contact the SRDS and say, “I want to rent my list, and here is all the information on it.” They’ll put it in there - like a directory.
 

Michael: I mean, a year ago I didn’t even know you could rent your lists. I never even heard of that until – anyone who has a business and who has a good amount of customers – renting your list is a whole additional source of income for your business – by renting out your name… but go on.
 

Bianco: Let me tell you – that’s true, but you really need a list of at least thirty thousand or more names to be able to rent it.
 

Michael: Okay.
 

Bianco: Fifty thousand is really the cut off. If you don’t have more than fifty thousand names its not a good idea to put them on the rental market because you’re not going to get much action from them.
 

Michael: Right if you’re a rental, but if I’m a guy who wants to do joint ventures and I found a targeted list for my market that maybe only had three thousand names, I could still do something with that.
 

Bianco: You could still make a ton of money. I mean, I don’t know how many people out there who are listening know Dan Kennedy, know who he is, but one of the things Dan Kennedy taught me is that you don’t need a humongous list to become rich. Dan told me that he use to have four hundred thousand names on his list and he use to make a couple hundred grand a year from them. Then when his list got down to - he shaved it down, he niched it out even more - down to about four thousand names, and then he made about a million bucks a year.
 

Michael: Did he really have four hundred thousand names on a list?
 

Bianco: Yes, and when his list got down to four hundred names, when he shaved it down and niched it out to just four hundred names, he makes multi millions a year from that because he’s selling those four hundred names high ticket items.
 

Michael: Wow.
 

Bianco: Four hundred names, it could make anyone of us wealthy, but you would never get it from him.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: But getting back to the SRDS and the lists that are in there. You can go through the SRDS in your niche category, find all the lists that are available for rent, and match your target prospect demographic. For example, your product sells for one hundred you want to try and find a list of people who have bought things for a hundred.
 

Michael: Why don’t you use a specific example?
 

Bianco: Okay. Let’s say you have a program on how to play better golf, you have a video and it sells for sixty-nine dollars and you say, “Well I want to sell this, but I don’t know how to sell it.” You go to the SRDS book - and you can buy these from you – I know you sell them occasionally on your website, or you can order it from SRDS for like six hundred bucks each. Sometimes you can get it at some of the bigger public libraries that carry it.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: Go in there and you check it out and you go through the lists and you look for golf lists that sell non-competitive products. Okay, obviously if another company sells golf videos, their product is similar to yours and they’re not going to let you rent their list.
 

Michael: Okay.
 

Bianco: So you might find a company that sells, let’s say they sell pitching wedges. Obviously, you sell a golf video on how to play better golf and they sell a pitching wedge, so you guys are harmonious. You guys can work together and help each other. What you would do is this: You would then look at their list. Let’s say their list says it has eight-five thousand names of people who have bought a pitching wedge in the past twenty-four months.
 

Michael: Okay.
 

Bianco: You could simply rent those names. A better way to go is to contact the owner of that list directly. You call the phone numbers that are listed in there, for either the list broker, or the list agent, or the company itself might have its direct number on there.
 

Michael: Okay.
 

Bianco: You ask them for what is called the data card.
 

Michael: What is a data card?
 

Bianco: It’s like a sheet of information that has all the information on how they generated those names, whether it’s from TV spots, print media, direct mail sales letters, what have you. It says where the names came from, how much the average ticket of purchase is, what dollar amount they bought, and then it says what their specific category is - like eighty percent male, thirty percent people have a college education – whatever information they’ve gathered – its all in there. Then you contact the owner of that list and propose a joint venture deal.
 

Michael: Okay can I interrupt? There’s one more thing you can do which I just learned about – you can also ask them for a usage list. You can get a list of everyone they’ve rented that list out to over the last year and sometimes the last two years and you can see how many, and which companies, used the list and which companies repeated the list.
 

Bianco: Exactly that would give you a good indication and here’s another little trick. You can ask the company with the list to send you a copy of the promotion they used to generate their sales.
 

Michael: Isn’t that incredible.
 

Bianco: And when you can analyze their promotion and figure out how they got eight-five thousand sales. You can weave the same psychology, the same emotional psychology that they used to generate the sales, into whatever your selling piece is.
 

Michael: Right, why try to guess? If the company sold pitching wedges using a certain psychology, or sold only to credit card buyers, or sold to only higher income people, you would want to use that same set of demographics and psychology in your piece.
 

Bianco: Yes, you want to look at their sales proposition – what was their unique sales proposition. Were they selling on the best price? Were they selling on exclusivity? What was the main thrust of their selling proposition? You want to make sure that yours is in the same area as that.
 

Michael: And how did they order. Did they pay by credit card, was it a free offer where they tried the pitching wedge for thirty days and then pay, was it a three payment program, was it a one payment program, you want to try and match it up identically.
 

Bianco: Yes there is no point in trying to reinvent the wheel. I mean, if people want a challenge out there, go have some kids.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: But in business you want to make it as easy as shooting fish in a barrel. You don’t need challenges in business and you shouldn’t try and get into areas where you go, “Oh, this is a real challenge – I want this.” What you want to do is go out there and find home runs and then hit them.
 

Michael: So look at this. We’ve got the companies direct mail piece, its generated them eighty thousand dollars in orders. We know how much it retailed for. We know how many sales they’re producing every month. The only thing we don’t know is how much their spending on advertising. If we could determine their exact cost on what they spend on mailing and promoting the direct mail piece, we could have all the necessary numbers to figure out everything about the business.
 

Bianco: Exactly. You can take the number of sales they make in a year and multiply it by the product cost and you can figure out, almost to the dollar, how much money that company is generating in sales every year.
 

Michael: Now let me ask you this. Do you have to beware with some of the information in the SRDS; can you trust everything in there?
 

Bianco: You can’t trust everything in there and, obviously in this short time I’m on the phone here, we can’t share years and years of experience in selecting the right list. There are some little tricks on tactics to make sure that you don’t get burned because there are a lot of unscrupulous people in life and in business too, so you’ve got to watch out. There’re definitely lists out there that are not worth renting - that you will get bogus information from - and so you need to learn how to pick the right list and there’re a lot of ways. There are a lot of people who teach that out there you. You can go to seminars that will teach you how to do that. I have a product that contains a two and half hour video that teaches you how to find the right list but in a nut shell – yes you’ve got to be careful, you can’t just trust everything that list brokers or companies trying to rent you their list tell you.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: You have to know how to weed out the winners from the losers.
 

Michael: Hey, Bianco, you really know your stuff. I mean, I’ve talked to you for many, many hours in the last couple years. How did you learn all this stuff? Tell me about how you got educated and got excited about direct marketing and entrepreneurship and all this stuff?
 

Bianco: Okay, well I started out in business probably about seventeen years ago and I was in college and…
 

Michael: How old are you now?
 

Bianco: Wanted to make some extra money.
 

Michael: How old are you?
 

Bianco: I’m thirty-eight.
 

Michael: You’re thirty-eight, okay.
 

Bianco: And I needed to make money for school. My education was being taken care of, but I needed some spending cash and I needed some money to do things, and buy stuff, and go places, and travel. So I started up a little company and my little company was a design company and I designed logos and graphics and brochures for corporations and small businesses.
 

Michael: Okay.
 

Bianco: And right away I realized no matter how great I was at designing and I was pretty good, not to toot my own horn, but I was pretty good. You know, I wasn’t the best in the world, but I was pretty good and I realized pretty quickly that it doesn’t matter how good you are at what you do it matters how good you are at marketing what you do.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: And so I learned really quickly that I was pretty good at getting sales and there was people I knew that were out there doing exactly what I was doing that were better than me but I was making a heck of a lot more money then them.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: And then I realized that there was something to this selling and marketing thing. So then after a few years of being in business I realized, what I wanted was to become an expert at marketing, because when I’m an expert at marketing I can help any business including my own drive sales right through the roof.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: So I went out and I basically said “Okay” and I bought all the books in the bookstore – which, by the way, ninety-nine point nine percent of them are written by professional writers.
Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: Who know absolutely nothing about what they’re talking about and all they do is go buy all the other books on the shelves, read them all, and then rehash it all out.
 

Michael: Just to sell a book.
 

Bianco: Just to sell a book. So what you get is every book out there is a rehash from a different writer’s perspective of the same stuff that doesn’t work.
 

Michael: Okay.
 

Bianco: So what I realized right away is that stuff doesn’t work. I bought all the books in the book store, I’ve tried everything they said and none of it works, and so then I went out and I found somebody who had a kick butt company making tons of money. I said “How did you learn to market so great?” and they said this persons name and they threw out some names: Claude Hopkins -and go read this if you can find it - John E. Kennedy “Reason Why Advertising” and these are some of the great books from the twenties and thirties about how to write direct response copy, how to write direct response ads and sales letters.
 

Michael: Do you remember how you first got exposed to it? The good stuff – do you remember?
 

Bianco: That was how – someone told me they recommended that those are the books I go buy.
 

Michael: Oh.
 

Bianco: And when I went and bought those books and read them I was floored. This stuff was amazing. I tried it. I wrote some sales letters, I wrote some ads and they worked like crazy. I was shocked and surprised and I continued it and said “who else? – I want to learn more…. there has got to be people alive today. These guys are all deceased, but there has got to be people alive today that know this stuff.” So I went to a Tony Robbins Seminar and he had a gentleman by the name of Jay Abraham as a speaker..
 

Michael: You went to that Mastery Seminar?
 

Bianco: I went to a Mastery Seminar with Tony Robbins.
 

Michael: That’s funny.
 

Bianco: And Jay Abraham was one of his speakers. He came up there and started talking about business and marketing and he just blew me away. In the one hour that he spoke, I felt like this guy’s brain and mine were separated at birth.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: Everything he said to me, it just triggered in my own head that I knew that, but I didn’t have the ability to articulate it until he explained it to me. Then, once he did, it was like “I knew it!” and I used it and I made a ton of money and I went out and I said “This is a guy who is going to be my mentor.” I contacted him by phone because he lives right here in California and I told him that I wanted to do barter with him. “I want to trade you one of the services that I do for one of the services you do - which is one of your upcoming protégé events. “
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: And he said “well, put it in writing, let me know what you’re thinking, I’m a real busy guy, and I’ll look forward to your letter.” So I sat down, I spent about a week writing, and rewriting, and rewriting, and rewriting this letter because I felt like this was my only one shot, if I didn’t make it work here with this letter, it wasn’t going to happen.
Michael: And you didn’t really have the money to pay twenty grand for this seminar.
 

Bianco: Yes. I didn’t have the money and I wanted to go. I knew this event would be a spring board to massive success for me.
 

Michael: Is this the protégé training?
 

Bianco: The protégé training.
 

Michael: In 1989 1990?
 

Bianco: In 1998.
 

Michael: Oh, 1998?
 

Bianco: Yes, 1998.
 

Michael: Oh, he did another protégé training?
 

Bianco: It might have been 1997. No, it was 97.
 

Michael: Okay.
 

Bianco: It was five years ago before my son was born.
 

Michael: Okay.
 

Bianco: My son was in the oven getting cooked.
 

Michael: There you go - a bun in the oven.
 

Bianco: I wrote this letter and I basically explained that I wanted to trade him one of the services that I performed that really range from anywhere from the Fifteen thousand to thirty thousand dollar range.
 

Michael: And what were you doing then?
 

Bianco: I was doing these interactive marketing CD ROMs for corporations like Texaco, Coldwell Banker, Disney and these things were really complicated - interactive – this was before the Internet. This was when the Internet was nothing but black and white text and everyone thought the Internet was a joke and it’s a bunch of computer geeks and it’s never going anywhere.
Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: So everyone was really hot and everyone had a computer or was hot on CD ROM. We would get these companies who would contact us and say “Hey, we saw what you did for Texaco we want you to do that for us.” Now we’re talking huge projects fifty, sixty, eighty, ninety thousand dollar projects.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: And they would take three months to develop. We were doing that and I said “You know what? Jay Abraham could have one of these for his seminars to promote his seminars.”
 

Michael: Was this your business that you were doing?
 

Bianco: My business.
 

Michael: You were doing it all on your own?
 

Bianco: All on my own. Well, I had programmers.
 

Michael: That you’d outsource stuff.
 

Bianco: That I outsourced stuff, exactly, subcontractors - to do certain programming or production of the CD, producing the actual CD stamping it out packaging, printing.
 

Michael: Was it a labor intensive job doing these things?
 

Bianco: Yes it was a real headache because the technology that we were using it had to work on both platforms Apple and PC so everything we did we had to do it twice.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: It’s really labor intensive when you had to change something, a color or a graphic or a video, it was just super time consuming and I was working twelve hours a day.
 

Michael: Did you have to travel?
 

Bianco: And I had to travel, as well. They’d have meetings to show it and all this. It was very tedious, very labor intense, and pretty much after about a year and a half of doing that, it was pretty unrewarding.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: Sure, you got paid good money, but it was really unrewarding.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: You never got to put your name on the product because it was their corporate product.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: And they didn’t want to promote you, they weren’t going to pay you all that money to have you promote yourself.
 

Michael: It was almost like a job.
 

Bianco: It was a job that was going nowhere because you never got any self promotion out of it.
 

Michael: Okay. I know your skills on the computer in graphic design were incredible.
 

Bianco: Well thank you.
 

Michael: You took that with you?
 

Bianco: Yes, I definitely took that with me on to my new ventures. So I basically contacted Jay and said “I want to trade you this twenty-five thousand dollar interactive CD and you let me come to your one event.”
 

Michael: Okay.
 

Bianco: I sent that letter out and I waited and about five six days went by and I thought, “Okay, I know he got the letter the day after I mailed it and it’s probably a dud, he’s probably not going to call me.” The event was only two weeks away. I said to myself, “Whatever - I’m not going to be going.” Then the phone rang and it was his assistant saying “Jay got your letter, he’s totally stoked, he wants to meet you and he wants to do this…”
 

Michael: Okay.
 

Bianco: “And he has some other ideas, he wants to do some things.” and I could not believe it! So we set up the meeting, and I was to go out there to Jay’s office. On the day before the meeting actually his assistant called me and said, “Do you mind going to Jay’s house, he’s not working tomorrow but he wants to meet with you still - so can you go to his house?” I thought, “Great no problem, go to his home…” This guy is making twenty million bucks a year and this is one of the top marketing guys in the world. That means that he makes thirty grand a day.
 

Michael: Were you really nervous?
 

Bianco: No, I wasn’t really nervous because I know a lot of very wealthy people and celebrities and stuff, so I wasn’t nervous. I was very excited.
 

Michael: Yes.
 

Bianco: I was excited. I was going to his home. It was going to be a lot more personal. I loved it. So I pull up to his beautiful home in Palisades – Palo Verde, California. I knocked on the door and his nanny opened the door. “Come on in, ” she said. This place was a palace… a mansion practically.
 

Michael: Yes.
 

Bianco: I go in there. Jay comes down - he’s in jeans and a t-shirt, he’s barefoot - “Hey, how you doing

Bianco? It’s nice to meet you.”
 

Michael: Yes.
 

Bianco: It was about 11:30. He asked if I had eaten yet and I told him that I hadn’t. He said “Hey, you want some lunch?” The next thing you know, we were sitting on his living room floor eating these salads – Jay’s really health conscious and I’m health conscious, too - so we’re eating salads and drinking this bottled water and we’re rapping out. He was asking me about my past and what I’m in to. Jay’s a real inquisitive guy.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: Real personable, real friendly. It was amazing. I’m just sitting there thinking, “Wow, this guy is nothing like I thought he would be.”
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: I figured he would be all business – What do you want, here’s the deal, okay great thank you, good bye see ya.” But he wasn’t like that at all. We spent two hours talking about everything, going over everything, and we basically put a deal together on a hand shake - and the next thing you know, I’m going to his event. One of the things that is great about Jay is that he said to me “Why do you only want to go to one of my events? Don’t you want to go to all of my events?”
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: I was thought “Sure!” but I didn’t think it was going to happen. He said, “Well you know what? Here’s what I’m going to do. If you do the CD for me you can come to all of my events for the next two years.” I thought “Wow!!” I could not believe it.
 

Michael: Okay.
 

Bianco: “You pay,” he said, “I’m not going to fly you there, you’ve got to pay for the flights - and I have my events all over the country - but I’ll let you in for free… and none of my events are less than five thousand dollar fees. I usually have three or four events per year and then I have one major event where it’s fifteen, twenty, twenty-five grand. You’re welcome to come to all of them.” I said “WOW! You’re the best Jay, thanks.” So then basically I went to the protégé thing and I got mind meld with Jay and I sucked up and absorbed everything and then he gave me a whole bunch of home study materials - like a lot of stuff he sells.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: I went through those tapes, listened to them day and night, pretty much for weeks and weeks and weeks and weeks. I read the books over and over and over, until I could use and implement anything without even having to reference the books again. I like do that stuff.
 

Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: And then I went out and started doing it. Using it for my clients and using it on my own businesses and just making tons of money - and to this day if I even use five or six of the strategies that I learned from Jay. I can make more money than a man could even need in his entire life, and that is what I do.
 

Michael: How do you like to learn best? Are you a reader, audio, video? What do you find is the most effective way for you in studying this marketing information?

Bianco: I like to read and listen to audio, that’s the two ways for me. Video, most of the videos, unfortunately, that are out there are rather boring. It’s someone standing on stage just standing there with no props, no diagrams, nothing.

Michael: Right.

Bianco: So the audio is pretty much the same - and I can listen to the audio while I am doing other things. I can be out cleaning my pool, or I can be out jogging, or riding my bike, or driving somewhere, and I can listen to it in my car.
 

Michael: Now, do you work out of a huge high rise office?
 

Bianco: No. I use to actually have a huge twelve hundred foot office that was my personal office. You know - big overhead, big expense, getting dressed up in a suit and tie everyday.
 

Michael: You don’t need it do you?
 

Bianco: But I didn’t like it, and I didn’t need it, so basically I have a big home. I have an office in my home and I do all my computer consulting and advising now through phone, fax, Internet, and e-mail. I rarely will go to the customer’s, or client’s, office.
 

Michael: Yes.
 

Bianco: If they’re local, I’ll drive over there once and a while.
 

Michael: There’s no doubt if anyone listening wants to become a joint venture expert like yourself, and has visions of going to a job or a regular office, like maybe your dad did, or what you think of when you have a job - it is absolutely the total opposite. You wake up you get out of bed, you don’t have to shower, you don’t even have to brush your teeth. You go sit down in your office and you can start doing business. You can do it on the phone, you can do it through e-mail, through a fax, through the Internet. It’s absolutely incredible. You can be home with your kids, even though you and I both know they can be a royal pain. There’s a lot of interruptions there… but the lifestyle. Talk about the lifestyle. If someone wanted to just get in to joint ventures and quit their normal jobs or start some joint ventures on the side. They could think about maybe quitting their normal job once their income got to a point where they felt secure enough. Let’s talk about the lifestyle.

Bianco: But I live in southern California, as well as you do, and southern California is probably one of the best places to live in the whole planet. I mean it’s just incredible the lifestyle here. You’ve got to have money to live in California; you’ve got to have money to live in southern California. I mean… I’m two minutes from the ocean.
 
Bianco: And I’m forty minutes from the mountains. I can go skiing and surfing in the same day if I want to.
 
Bianco: And the lifestyle… I have a beautiful home and I have a pool, like I said, go to my website and I have some of those pictures you can see the lifestyle that joint venture marketing has allowed me to live. The lifestyle, my dream, I am living my dream.
 
Bianco: And most people out there are stuck in a nine-to-five job. They hate it and it’s a rat race. The money comes in and the money goes out - just as fast - and they can never get ahead in life. Joint venture marketing, learning how to do joint venture marketing can allow you to break that cycle and to step away and leave all that behind and start really living your dream.

Michael: Okay, but it is easier said then done. Now lets say a guys got two kids like yourself, and like myself, and he’s been in a j-o-b a job working for a boss he can’t stand, fighting traffic every day, up early out the door at six home at seven the kids. Maybe just went to sleep, so he’s a weekend dad and he’s scared to leave that job or he doesn’t believe that this really can be done. How do you convince him, or if you had a magic pill that you could put in this guys coffee in the morning, what do you need to do and think internally to get over that fear to just go for it. I mean do you have an answer?
 

Bianco: The reason that they have that fear is basically just lack of knowledge lack of know-how. They don’t know how to do it. So, the first thing they need to do is they need to get educated on joint venture marketing, if that’s the route they want to take.
Michael: Now, where can someone get some good marketing books and tapes from?
 

Bianco: Well that’s a good question. In a lot of the book stores, there’s nothing. Don’t go to the book stores. What you need to do is you need to go to your website at www.hardtofindseminars.com.
 

Michael: Okay.

Michael: All right, I want to stop right there because I want to go back to your program, but first let’s talk about – this person who has a lack of knowledge. So if that person took the time to educate themselves on marketing, is that enough to set them over the edge to take the risk and try and put some of these deals together.
 

Bianco: It is. Because once you learn how easy it is, and you have template letters and things like that, to contact people, and information to educate the prospect - the people you want to do the joint venture with - you’ll have the ammunition and the confidence to do it. Think about it. When you’re learning something new, you don’t know how to do it. How much confidence does someone have? Do you play a sport? Do you play tennis, golf, or anything like that?
 

Michael: No.
 

Bianco: Do you ride bikes? What do you do for a hobby?
 

Michael: I run – I do running for exercise .I run.
 

Bianco: Okay. So when you first started running, did you know how to run like an expert runner?
Michael: No.
 

Bianco: Did you know where to run and how fast to run. No. You went out and started running you took the first step.
Michael: Right.
 

Bianco: And the next step and the next step. Well it’s the same as with getting educated to change careers and to start living your dream. You just take baby steps.
Michael: All right, okay. Let me ask you this – you mentioned letters- does that mean if I’m a shy person and the thought of getting on the phone and actually talking to someone scares the hell out of me - can I still do joint ventures and still be able to sit in front of my computer and still be able to use a letter to set these deals up?
 

Bianco: Yes, and you don’t even really need a computer to do this. All you need is the will and the information - and like I said, in this program that I sell, there are template letters to contact the joint venture partners and that letter explains to them everything they need to know to make a decision that they want to do a joint venture, and so you can use letters so that you don’t have to talk to anybody until they’re ready to go ready to do the deal. So, yes, you don’t have to pick up the phone and do all kinds of cold calling to companies and stumbling over yourself to make sure you don’t say the wrong thing. There’s templates you can use – letters that do all the selling for you and you want to use the letters anyways, because how many phone calls can one guy make in a day - or one girl make in a day? Twenty, thirty, fifty a hundred if you hustle? How many letters can one person send out in a day? Hundreds!
 

Michael: Absolutely. You use the post man to do all your work.
 

Bianco: It’s leveraging your time. So here’s a snap shot of what can happen. You get the program, you learn how to do it, your ready to go, you see ten companies - ten businesses that are in your neighborhood you think would be good joint venture partners, you put their name and address on the letter and you drop those in the mail today and you go play golf all day. The next day your phone rings – five of them call you and say “This is very interesting concept, I want to do this. Yes, your letter told me everything and I want to move forward.” You’d say “Great.” You’d put the two companies together, you have them do a hand shake agreement or a little agreement that says this company is going to recommend this other companies stuff they’re going to split the profits this way. Then my client company, the company that is receiving the money, is going to pay me ten, fifteen, twenty percent. It doesn’t matter what the percentage is. The key is just to get some joint ventures under your belt. Get the experience, and then going for the higher percentage amount of money.
 

Michael: Okay.
 

Bianco: Don’t let that stop you from getting a deal. Even if you have to make no money on the first deal you do, get it done so you can have that success story to share with everyone else.
 

Michael: Right and start building your confidence and because it takes the same exact amount of time to do a joint venture for ten cents as it does for ten million dollars.
 

Bianco: Exactly. And right now I am working on a humungous joint venture deal where my joint venture partner will introduce one of my products. The product sells for four ninety-seven and I will share half the profits. And they have to have a customer list that is a rapid buyer list. I mean these people buy stuff in the five hundred to five thousand dollar range – constantly - and we’re going to do a mailing to a hundred and twenty-five thousand name list in the next thirty days and we expect to net five figures each.
 

Michael: Is this better then investing in the stock market?
 

Bianco: Yes, That’s the thing a lot of people will say what about real estate. What about the stock market? What about buying and selling notes and all these other like really complicated things? Well, the problem with all that stuff is you have no control over what happens once you put your money into that investment. Whereas with direct marketing, and joint venture marketing, you can test on a very small scale. You can test something for a couple hundred dollars and see the results. You can see what is going to happen and if it doesn’t work you can tweak it and twist it and test it again. And once you find that program that works, then you can roll it out to tens of hundreds of thousands of people that you can predict with very, very accurate predictions, what your results are going to be because you can just multiple them out.
 

Michael: Bianco, hey this has been an incredible, educational, informative conversation on joint ventures. It really has.
 

Bianco: I really enjoyed being here. It was a pleasure. Mike, you’re always a great interviewer. I love listening to your interviews myself. I always learn a lot, I’m a constant and continually eternal student myself. I call myself an expert because other people do, because I have had some fantastic results in my consulting and in my advisory, but also I look at myself as an eternal student myself I am always learning, I never stop learning, I never want to stop learning.
 

Michael: That’s great. Hey, listen, for my listeners only …can you give them - and only for my listeners - your personal phone line, if they wanted to call you and just rap?
 

Bianco: Yes, I could give you that.
 

Michael: Okay.
 

Bianco: My personal phone line number is area code 949-690-6302. 949-690-6302.
 

Michael: And, as you said earlier, and we were discussing, if any of my listeners call Bianco, he graciously extended a thirty minute consultation absolutely free.
 

Bianco: Yes. I’ll talk to them and see what they are doing and where they want to go - and I’ll give them some help and point them in the right direction.
 

Michael: All right, I really appreciate that.
 

Bianco: Okay, Mike.
 

Michael: All right.
 

Bianco: Thanks for giving me the opportunity to be interviewed here and I hope everything is going great for you in the future and I wish you the best.