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Arrie: Let me tell you. Cold calling the old way can be psychologically traumatic because you’re being personally rejected. You’re doing what you’ve been told to do. You’re playing the numbers game. Every call you’re getting pushback, and you wonder why this feels so bad. It’s literally inhumane, and the issue is not the performance of the person who’s calling, and it’s not your product. The problem is the approach. The approach is outdated. It’s old school, and it triggers the wrong impression.

So, what I’m suggesting is that people can actually make calls in a comfortable manner as if calling a friend, and without being rejected.

Michael: I did an interview with a guy who had some experience with cold calling, and I have someone who edits all my audio recordings, and as she was editing it, she had heard of you. She said, “You may want to check this guy out”, and she sent me to your website, and that’s how I originally heard about you.

As I was reading, I go, “This sounds really good.” And, it’s something that I think a lot of people who come to my site, HardtoFindSeminars.com , let’s face it there’s a lot of people out there pounding the phone. With long distance service so inexpensive especially even internationally, it is an extremely effective and great way to sell, but so many people like you say have been programmed with the sales gurus, and it’s painful. People don’t like to do it because of a lot of the reasons you talk about on your site.

So, tell me, how do you get into all of this? Are you a speaker? Are you a sales trainer? Who is Arrie?

Arrie: Well, pretty much my whole career has been behind the scenes. I’ve been in charge of developing and designing sales training for very large companies.

Michael: Where did you all start? Were you in sales in high school?

Arrie: Well, I did sell in college a bit, but where it started is I actually have a Master’s Degree in education and training. It’s actually called “Instruction Design”. It’s a specialized field that has develop instruction and training information for people so they can best use and implement it on the job.

So, after getting that degree, I got a job in the sales training department of both UPS and Qualcomm.

Michael Where were you located then?

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Arrie: In San Diego and then Atlanta, and I was basically involved with designing and developing training programs for salespeople worldwide, and I was in charge of bringing in some of the gurus to speak. So, I got to sit in all of the sales training programs around the market.

Michael: Did you get that job because that was your major in college? Who hired you first Qualcomm or UPS?

Arrie: UPS.

Michael: So, UPS Hired you and they brought you into do what?

Arrie: To develop and design product and sales training for their worldwide sales force.

Michael: Wow.

Arrie: They had a small sales training department at the corporate office in Atlanta, and I was involved with rolling out many of the services. I actually would literally write and create the selling materials and training for the sales people.

Michael: That’s a pretty big responsibility for a company like UPS.

Arrie: It was, and the funny thing is I was never the trainer. I was the designer of training. I wrote and I thought through everything.

Michael: How many years were you with UPS?

Arrie: About four years.

Michael: And, did you like it?

Arrie: I loved it, great company, very practical, very innovative, good people. I really loved it. I did really a lot of fun things there.

Michael: And, they were probably really kicking butt at that time.

Arrie: Oh yeah. I rolled out about twelve new products in about two years. I was in charge of the training wise. So, I was really involved with heavy sales training and new product development.

Michael: Could you see the results of your efforts? Could you see an increase in sales from some of the training stuff you developed?

Arrie: Here’s the interesting thing – not only increase in sales, but people just thanked us for the appreciation of the program, of the materials. They were so concise. They were step by step. They were very customer oriented, and they had the psychology behind them in terms of how to connect to people.

Michael: Now, where were you doing your research to put it all together?

Arrie: It was just based upon our group’s experience. I never really had a role model myself in terms of any kind of guru, just my aunts basically. It was just organic I guess I could say.

Michael: And, you were with them for four years, and then Qualcomm hired you away?

Arrie: Yeah, I had to come to San Diego where I grew up, and Qualcomm was in their hey day at the time. They were just hiring crazily there, and they were hiring a lot of sales people. So, they needed some more sales training thinking and development. So, I got hired there as a senior developer and there I developed a similar aspects in training and product development, briefings I would call them. So, I just spent a lot of time on how sales people best could talk to customers in a non-aggressive way. That’s where I got a lot of my thinking from.

Michael: Did you know Irwin Jacobs personally over there?

Arrie: No, I met him a couple of times, but I didn’t know him on a personal basis.

Michael: How many people were on your team for that department?

Arrie: I think there were maybe about four or five of us, small group, and then I got moved into one of the divisions called Omni Tracks where I was involved in training for their sales force. So, it was a really good experience.

From there, I actually left and cut my own teeth in direct selling with a company called Website Story. They actually offered online software services to track website user behavior, like the way people travel to websites and how they buy. So, I was involved with helping them grow and selling their products.

That job, I was actually managing 18 salespeople. I sold myself, and that’s where I really began to form a lot of my ideas.

Michael: When you were at Qualcomm and UPS was the feedback from the sales force helpful in you finding out what was really working and what wasn’t?

Arrie: Oh yeah, because I would go out in the field with them, and I’d go on sales calls with them, and we had this hotline right to the sales force. So, we were very much engaged the front lines. That’s how we were able to piece it all together from their perspective.

Michael: So, this was like a big laboratory that you were involved with for almost seven or eight years.

Arrie: Yes, it was.

Michael: And, a lot of that feedback is a result of what you’ve put together now in your training?

Arrie: Yes, and also just a lot of my exposure of being with those big companies. I got exposed to a lot of training programs that a lot of these corporations bring in and pay for.

Michael: What was your thoughts on that? How much would a company pay for when they brought in training?

For more details on this cold calling system go here or call Michael at 858-274-7851

Arrie: I would say up to hundreds of thousands of dollars for company wide training for these large corporate type of training events. So, I was involved with the proposal process, bringing them in. I would actually get to sit in the back of the room, which is the greatest thing of all and take notes. When I was in that room and watching this training program, I noticed a big hole, a big hole in all these programs and that was that all these training programs taught people to mentally focus on closing the sale.

What they did not teach you to do was how to build trust first, how to execute that and that was the missing piece that I realized help me uncover this whole idea.

Michael: Why does the trust issue have to come before closing the sale? Why was that a hole?

Arrie: Well, because if someone does not trust you first and is comfortable telling you the truth on where they stand, they’re going to pull you down what I call a chasing game which is they may show interest. They may say it sounds great. Yes, we’re interested. But, in reality, they may not be.

So, what happens a lot of times the sales people get very excited when they get a prospect that says they’re interested, they assume that what they’re heArrieng is absolutely accurate and true, and then when they call the person back and get their voicemail, and never get a callback, they wonder what happened, why they got stuck.

What I found in my experience is that salespeople in general, people who sell who’ve exposed the old way of selling, when they mentality only focus on the outcome, then what happens is all their words and phrases and all the momentum is driven by that, and people on the phone pick that up a mile away and this sets alarms off and they pushback on the sales person. That’s where the whole conflict begins.

Michael: Okay, before we get into some of this, all this learning, all this learning, all your experience with UPS, with Qualcomm and being able to sit like a fly on the wall and watch these large dollar sales training programs, after you’ve designed and engineered your own unique program from learning all of this. What’s the big promise that a listener maybe who comes to my site, how are they going to benefit from maybe listening and using any of your products or ideas or techniques that they’re not going to find anywhere else?

Arrie: The major benefit is removing the fear and the mental reluctance of making the call. That is the biggest issue that everybody in sales has right now.

Michael: They can’t stand it. They would rather eat glass.

Arrie: It’s like a 10,000 pound weight. There’s a mental block, and let me tell you cold calling the old way can be psychologically traumatic because you’re being personally rejected. You’re doing what you’ve been told to do. You’re playing a numbers game, and every call you’re getting pushback. You wonder why this feels so bad.

It’s literally inhumane and the issue is not the performance of the person who’s calling and it’s not your product. The problem is the approach. The approach is outdated. It’s old school, and it triggers the wrong impression.

So, what I’m suggesting is that people can actually make calls in a comfortable manner as if calling a friend and without being rejected.

Michael: But, I’ve pounded the phone, and isn’t it true that if you’re tough and you just let it roll off your shoulder and you pound the phone, you understand that if you do your numbers maybe one out of twenty may end up being good, and the ones who reject you, you just blow them off and just move on. Is that still somewhat valid?

Arrie: It’s completely valid. It’s your personal choice. You can choose that manner of being tough and getting beat up and feeling good about, and squeezing out a couple sales a day. Absolutely, that’s been happening right now in hundreds of companies all over the world. The issue is that that’s not the only way.

There’s a much more efficient, much more humane way of calling people. It’s simple a personal choice. Do you want to continue to be beat up like that, or do you want to make friends and build relationships and actually make sales the easy way?

Michael: Before we get into specifics, do you have some case studies or some stories of maybe some of the people of what they were experiencing before and after using your system? Can you talk about some of the success they’ve had?

Arrie: Sure, I’ll be happy to tell you one story with a gentleman named Bruce who actually was a teacher. He got laid off from being a teacher, and he went into insurance sales. He called me in tears. He was so fearful of making that call, anticipating the rejection.

Michael: Had he started yet?

Arrie: No, he hadn’t started. He just couldn’t pick up the phone because his only mental experience of selling was the phone calls he gets at home every night. So, what he did not want to be and nobody wants to be is that stereotype that everybody hates so much, that negative selling stereotype.

So, he was afraid and fearful that if he would start making calls, he would sound like those people even though he wasn’t like them. It’s like this role reversal.

Michael: Yeah, that’s true because I’m just thinking from my perspective I’ve made thousands of calls, but there are a lot of people out there who’ve never made a sales call and the only thing they can relate to are the terrible telemarketers calling you during dinner time.

Arrie: Therein lies the core blockage. See, people associate selling with that negative image. That’s what scares everybody away. What they don’t know – they’re not aware that the whole different mindset is a different way of looking and thinking and doing this that’s pleasant and productive.

Michael: So, he called you and you worked with him a little bit and he ordered some of your products.

Arrie: He bought the program. I worked with him personally, and what we did was we basically helped him sort of detox from his old way of thinking and provide him with actual tools and words and phrases and a new mindset to help him approach the call in a way where he’s not selling.

Instead he becomes a problem solver, and that’s the mental shift that’s taught in the program to sort of shift mentally to that mode, and then to have a strategy to enter that call in a way where you’re not pitching your solution. Instead, you’re actually addressing the issue that you’re solution solves for the person you’re calling. It’s a different way of thinking.

Michael: So, how did that go when you started making calls with his insurance?

Arrie: I’ll tell you, he actually was nice enough to leave me an audio message. It was radically amazing for him. He was able to make calls and get appointments with such ease, he was in complete shock. He even told his wife that he looked forward to making more calls. So, it’s a complete transformation.

The funny thing is most people don’t believe it’s possible because they’re so used the negative mental effect of calling and the rejection, they just do not believe it’s possible. But, if you change your mental mindset, and you have an approach that does not create sales alarms to go off in the person’s mind you’re calling, you’re going to have pleasant conversations and be extremely effective without being aggressive.

Michael: Okay, that’s great. Can you give me another story, any other case studies of any of your clients that really stick out?

Arrie: What’s interesting is I’ve got case studies from almost every industry possible from software to selling furniture to coaches, and what’s interesting about these case studies is that what people discover is that it’s not about what they’re selling. It’s about how they’re selling.

I’ll give you an example. I had someone just a few weeks ago purchase the program, and it’s a husband and wife who basically opened their own record label. He sells music, his own music actually, and he came from the old school way of selling – the numbers game, basically being aggressive on the phone, closing his eyes and hoping it works. He just absolutely hated the idea of doing this again.

Here he was, created a project for himself, and he wanted a much more comfortable way of approaching people. So, he bought the program, and he likens this to his creative way of making music in a way where you can actually connect to people in a natural way without a linear step by step script. He’s actually having complete success because he’s able to be himself, speak his own words, and not be scripty and still make the sale.

Michael: Can we do a case study? Can I give you a specific situation that I liked to get your help on?

Arrie: Yes.

For more details on this cold calling system go here or call Michael at 858-274-7851

Michael: For instance, I sell consulting services, and one method that I would teach somebody is to buy leads from Information USA, probably of manufacturing companies within a geographical area right around San Diego or wherever they’re located, and the business is doing between a million and five million a year in gross, and I have the name of the owner.

So, what would you advise if I’ve got my list in front of me, I’m getting ready to pound the phone and the goal is to see if I can identify a prospect who’d like to grow their business, who is in pain and would like to grow their business through a new approach in marketing without having to spend more money on advertising.

Arrie: Well, there’s a mental process that we have to go through first. Let me ask you a question. What would you say would be the major problem that you help probably with your solution? I’ll ask that first.

Michael: The major problem would be to help them get growth with low-cost, inexpensive marketing methods.

Arrie: Growth means what?

Michael: Let’s say more money for the business, more sales, more gross profit.

Arrie: What I should tell you right now because of the coaching classes, what I’m trying to do is help you articulate specifically at a tactical level what he gets for your solution.

So, sales in general would be a little abstract. What we talk about is more inbound leads, more phone calls, obviously more revenue. I’m trying to cover the right wording to really be much more tactical.

So, what you’re saying is your marketing solves the problem of him being able to generate more sales and more revenue, right?

Michael: Yes, that is correct.

Arrie: Okay, so that’s the problem that we solve for them. So, traditionally if I was coaching you and I was an old guru, I’d say to you, “Look, make a phone call, build some rapport, and give a pitch about what you do.” Right?

Michael: Right.

Arrie: And, get their attention and hopefully it will keep going from that point.

Michael: Right, I may say, “This is Michael with Michael Senoff Consulting and the reason I’m calling is I’d like to know if you’d be interested in growing your business without having to spend more money on advertising.”

Arrie: Right. Now, let me ask you a question. If someone calls you on the phone and says, “Hi, my name is Michael. I’m with XYZ Company. We do this.” What goes through your mind in a couple of seconds?

Michael: I know it’s a salesperson.

Arrie: That’s right. So, we don’t want to use that approach because the minute you say, “Hello, my name is”, it’s over. The minute it’s in the mind, you’re fighting a battle which is very difficult to win.

So, what we teach is a different way of thinking. We teach our goal that first call is to not get the appointment first. The first goal of that call is to diffuse the pressure from the call, remove the suspicion, built the trust.

The way you do that is you begin the call with – and it’s all laid out step by step in the material – but, you begin the call with, “Hi, my name is Arrie. I’m with XYZ Company”, and the first thing you say is, “We haven’t met yet.”

Michael: Okay, “We haven’t met yet.”

Arrie: Because what do you think that does to the conversation? What does it help the person do?

Michael: It helps them relax.

Arrie: It helps them relax, and you’re big enough to let them know that you haven’t met yet. You’re removing some of the suspicion because they’re probably wondering, “Who is this guy?” Right?

Michael: Yes, so you’re answering their question.

Arrie: Yeah, there’s a lot of psychology here. It’s important to breakdown for it before you move forward. It’s important to build that conversation the way that does not trigger the wall.

Michael: I’m going to do this no matter who answers, secretary, owner or whatever.

Arrie: That’s really your contact, I mean your call-in contact, have the name of somebody. In respect for them, it’s just normal conversation that we haven’t met yet.

Michael: What if I get a gatekeeper?

Arrie: That’s a separate scenArrieo.

Michael: So, this is if I’m talking to my contact.

Arrie: Yeah, like you said, you have a name of someone to call, right? You would just basically say, “My name is Arrie. I’m with XYZ Marketing, and we haven’t met yet.” Let conversation sort of level out a little bit there.

Then we’d say, “Maybe you can help me out for a minute.” That’s what we say next, “Maybe you can help me out for a moment.” Typically they’ll say, “How can I help you?”

Now, the delivery is very important here. I’m not become aggressive. I’m not going to be excited. It’s going to be a very relaxed entry point like this, “My name is Arrie. We haven’t met yet, and I’m with XYZ Company. I’m hoping you can help me out for a moment.”

Michael: Okay, how can I help you?

Arrie: Right, that’s what happens almost every single time.

Michael: Wow, that’s great.

Arrie: Because you’re drawing them into you. You’re not pushing back with, “Hi! My name is Arrie! Do you have a couple seconds?”

Michael: Yeah, exactly. That’s good.

Arrie: It’s over.

Michael: You’re right. That’s true.

Arrie: So, we’re completely unaware of how we’re being perceived and how we’re being received by the person. Sixty seconds is broken down into a four hour program for a reason, because there’s so many elements that we haven’t thought of that would actually cause the rejection to happen.

So, anyway, we move on. He says, “How can I help you?” Then, we move directly into the problem statement. So, then I’m going to say, “I’m just giving you a call to see if you’d be open to some different ideas on how to bring in more sales into your business.”

Michael: That’s great.

Arrie: Now, what have I not done there?

Michael: You haven’t pushed anything on me. You’re asking his opinion, or you’re asking if he’s open. You’re trying to identify his openness.

Arrie: I haven’t made a pitch. I haven’t told him what I do. I haven’t pushed. I didn’t even say, “If you’d be interested”, did I?

Michael: Yeah.

Arrie: You never use sales words like, “would you be interested”. They’re all overused.

Michael: You got rid of that. So, you just said, “Would you be open?”

Arrie: Would you be open to some different – not new ideas. Why not new? Because every salesperson in the world says new and improved, right?

Michael: True.

Arrie: Every single word that I’m using now is chosen for a reason. It’s designed to detach any wording that might associate you with a negative stereotypical salesperson image. And, that’s what we breakdown. The program is a word for word way to approach people that’s natural and engaging without a pitch. So, I’m doing the call here identifying the problem not the solution.

So, anyway, what typically happens is you get one of two responses. You get, “What do you mean?” Or you get, “Who’s this?”

Michael: You get one or the other more than the other.

Arrie: Well, it depends how – if he delivers in a natural way, they might say, “Well what do you mean?” And, that gives you permission to move forward in terms of being more specific about what you do.

So, in your case you might say, “Well, what I mean specifically is looking at a different marketing strategy that’s probably you a lot less than you pay now, and giving you much more sales.”

Michael: Okay, tell me more.

Arrie: Okay, so this is what we’re looking for. What we’re looking for with this approach is “Tell me more.” “Tell me more” “Tell me more”, because you’re slowly creating a conversation, not bombarding them with so much information in the pitch. And, you’re giving them a chance to breath. That’s the whole point. This is a two way dialogue, not a one way pitch. That’s why this is a natural way of calling people.

Let’s just say he says, “Who’s this?” You simply just sort of say, “I’m sorry. My name is Arrie. I’m with XYZ Company, and I’m just giving you a call”, and go right back to the same problem statement. You don’t give him tips about what you do. You just go right into, “What we do is we help companies with different ideas to bring in more revenue and sales to the company.”

You mentally stick on their issues, on their problems, because as premature as to offer a pitch about you until you first have acknowledgement to the issue they want to solve.

Michael: So, that’s pretty much the rule. Make sure they acknowledge the issue that you’re going to solve for them before you get into you.

Arrie: Exactly. That is the mindset. The mindset is to focus on them and not you.

Michael: That’s important because they don’t care about you. They want their problem solved. That’s what you’re there about.

Arrie: Exactly, but traditional thinking suggests the opposite. When we go to companies and we’re hired, we’re taught to do what? To be an expert on our product and then start talking about it. They have been taught to think from their point of view. That’s the big conflict is that if you’ve been taught the traditional way, your confidence comes from your product knowledge not from the ability to generate the conversation from their point of view, and that’s what we provide is an expansion of people’s mindsets to help them generate the conversation in a natural way.

Michael: All right, and this strategy can be used for any product or service all across the board.

Arrie: Anything because what we don’t do here is focus on what you’re selling. We focus on how you’re doing it, and then we design a problem statement around it. It’s designed to test your solution.

So, there’s two steps. There’s a mindset. Then, there’s the languaging or the words and the phrases that are targeted towards a problem you’re supposed to solve.

Michael: Now, obviously it’s not going to work a hundred percent of the time, but it’s certainly going to work a lot better than the old way. Give me the negative side. Where do you hear the rejection come up and how do you teach people to handle that?

Arrie: Well, I do have a whole section on objections, of course. There will be some resistance with some people. People are just so numb and so sensitized to these sales calls, no matter what you say there might be some pushback. There’s no hundred percent perfect exact method that’s going to work every single time. It reduces the likelihood of any objection and pushback on the phone because what was doing wouldn’t trigger that.

So, I do have a whole methodology around how to diffuse objections that we can talk about if you like.

Michael: Yes, let’s talk about it.

Arrie: Okay, so let’s talk about some common ones that probably everyone can relate to. Say if someone says to you, “Michael, we already are using another marketing method.” Would that be a comment?

Michael: Absolutely, yes.

Arrie: And, what would you say? Just in your opinion, how would most people respond to that typically?

Michael: Most people would probably just say, “That’s great. Can you tell me how are they working for you?”

Arrie: That’s right. Okay, so what we’ve been taught to do is to overcome the objection, right? That’s what we’ve been taught to do is sort of cleverly overcome it to get passed it.

Michael: Right, by asking questions trying to get a hook in to overcome it.

Arrie: That’s right, but what’s the risk if the other person does not feel you’re heArrieng what they’re saying as to be true?

Michael: They’re going to build resistance and they’re going to frustrated and they’re going to stop listening to you.

Arrie: That’s right. So, we’re creating more pressure by overcoming what they’re trying to say. That’s the real problem. That creates more pressure on the situation.

We teach a whole different way of looking at objections. What we teach is to first diffuse the objection, and reopen the conversation again.

So, in this example, how we handle this is if someone says to me, “Arrie, we’re already using another vendor.” What I’d say is what you always say whenever you get an objection. You always say, “That’s not a problem.” That’s the first thing you say is, “That’s not a problem.” That helps the moment breath for a second. “That’s not a problem.”

Then you say, “I wasn’t calling to replace who you currently have. I was just calling to see if you’d be open to some different ideas that you may not have now.”

Michael: That’s great because that does answer his real objection.

Arrie: Right, what I’m basically saying is, “Look, I’m not going to rip out what you have. That’s not my goal. My goal is to generate a conversation with you to see if you’d be open to the different ideas.” That’s how we handle objections.

We have every single objection written down with a response in a way that diffuses it so there’s no tension and no pressure. So, you can reopen up again to really get to the truth of where everything stands.

Michael: Let’s do another objection. What’s another real common one?

Arrie: Another one might be the budget. That’s always a pretty common one. “We don’t have the budget for it.”

Michael: Yes, let’s do that one.

Arrie: Okay, again, if someone responds, “We don’t have the budget.” Of course, we teach to always, always, always begin responding with, “That’s not a problem.” That’s kind of funny. There’s no problems, right?

Michael: Right.

Arrie: Believe it or not, by just saying, “That’s not a problem”, it sort of disarms the person. You have a chance to kind of calm the moment down a bit. So, what you would say is, “That’s not a problem. A lot of our clients did not have the budget at first for this. That’s completely common and that’s why we have come up with a business case to help make a justification for it. Would you be open to some ideas around that?”

Michael: There you go, back to “Would you be open to”.

Arrie: Yeah, so if I’m offering solutions, I’m not overcoming their objection. I’m acknowledging their objection to be true which is so rare because we’re used to going right past it and overcoming it, trying to beat it, and that’s the problem. That conflict creates the pressure on the conversation.

Michael: Let’s do one more because that’s excellent. What’s another real common objection?

Arrie: A real sticky one is “Your price is too high.” Is that common?

Michael: Yep. So, you say, “That’s not a problem.”

Arrie: Exactly! That’s the first thing. “Michael, your price is too high.” So, the first thing you say is, “That’s not a problem.” Then, what you say is – again, the goal is to validate what they’re saying to be true from their point of view. So, what you say is, “You’re absolutely right. You’re absolutely right that the price can be perceived as high if you haven’t yet had a chance to use the program, yet. You’re absolutely right. Would you be open to some different ideas on how to make the pricing work for you in a way that feels comfortable for you and meets your need?”

Michael: Yeah, that’s excellent. So, you’ve got every one of these objections, you’ve got all this stuff scripted out in your course.

Arrie: The course contains every imaginable objection possible. It’s a methodology route in the mindset and the wording.

Michael: When did you start putting the course together? When did you get the idea that, “Okay, I’ve got this training with UPS, with Qualcomm. I succeeded in doing direct sales through your software company.”?

Arrie: About four years now. It’s been four years it’s on the market. There have been thousands of people using it, and it has a life of it’s own now. What I’m getting is a lot what I call “sales refugees” – people from the old school way of thinking who are just tired of getting beat up on the phone, and they’re all coming this way because they want go back to what’s most natural for them to be effective without being aggressive.

Michael: Have you seen anything else out there like it? Like all the sales guru, the stuff I grew up on – Brian Tracey and Zig Zigler and all those guys. Are they still pretty solid on their opinion?

Arrie: I like Brian Tracey a lot. I think he has some really good stuff. I have a lot of his programs. He actually endorses me. I’ve got to say out of all the gurus out there, he’s got some of the best stuff because it’s not aggressive, but it’s very intelligent.

But most people teach because they say, “Look, don’t be salesy, don’t be pitchy, think positive, and accept rejection as normal.” They try and explain how to sell, and what they’re missing is how to build trust. They don’t have the words and the phrases and the psychological framework to enter that first call.

If you look around the market right now, you’re not going to find too many people who teach how to break that 60 seconds down into a method that’s natural and comfortable and does not create rejection. That’s the missing piece that no one has created yet, and that’s what makes it so successful.

Michael: I’ve got some bullets here from your website. Can we go over a couple of these?

Arrie: Sure, yeah.

Michael: Okay, I’ve got “Asking questions doesn’t guarantee the truth.” What does that mean?

Arrie: Well, a lot of the old school corporate programs teach when you make a phone call to someone, the first thing you do is start asking them questions about their business like, “How long have you been in business?” “What are your problems?” You kind of go on a fishing expedition. You try and get the information from them to see if you’re a good fit with them or not.

The problem with that is people don’t have the patience or aren’t willing to share with you the truth about their situation if they don’t know who you are and trust you yet.

So, this old school method of just calling and start asking questions about their business to identify the problem is outdated and creates an issue because people in most cases are not going to tell you their problems unless they trust you first.

So, what we teach is deal with the call already knowing their core problem. The way you get that is you think about why people have already bought your solution and think about three core issues that your solution solves and use those to call, and that’s what we have is a methodology to convert your solution to their problem statements.

So, that statement about asking questions getting the truth, what I’m saying is people will not tell you the truth if you’re asking questions and they don’t trust you yet.

Michael: All right, “The mindset – people not prospects.”

Arrie: The concept there is to use a call as a conversation between you and another human being, and when you just use the other person just as a prospect, it’s detaches you from the other person and how they’re receiving you.

So, what I’ve tried to do here is connect two human beings together in a much more natural way without there being this buyer and seller tension, where someone’s trying to sell the other person something they may or may not need.

So, the idea of viewing a person as a human being, as a person, what that does is just helps the person selling to connect with the person at a much more natural level.

Just the words themselves actually help that.

Michael: Right, “Voice mail is the beginning, not the end.” How do you handle voice mail with so many voice mail systems out there? What recommendations would you have for that?

Arrie: Well, we teach a whole methodology around that, and primArriely the premise of if you get voicemail and you have no other option, then you’re basically rolling the dice. You have no other way to get way a hold of the person. Look, leave a message, but you have no guarantee of getting a call back.

We do have some ideas around that. One – if you get voicemail, you can hit zero and go back to the front desk, and there’s a way to basically in a non-aggressive way identify the whereabouts of where the person is, and we teach that. I’ll use a couple of examples.

Michael: Let’s do it.

Arrie: Normally, if you’re sort of the traditional salesperson, you call back and you hit zero and say, “Hi, is Jim around?”

Michael: No, he’s tied up right now. May I take a message?

Arrie: Exactly, and then you’re stuck. So, what we do is we teach to call back and hit zero and say, “Maybe you can help me out for a method.”

Michael: Okay, sure.

Arrie: I tried to get a hold of Jim, but I got his voicemail. Would you happen to know if he’s at lunch, in a meeting or vacation by any chance? See, I’m offering solutions right away to help the other person guide me. What I’m trying to do here is identify where he might be.

So, in any case, one of those three questions might be the answer.

Michael: If he’s on vacation, you know you don’t have to call back. If he’s at lunch, you can call him back in an hour.

Arrie: Exactly Michael! What we’re doing is we’re extracting information to decide whether to move on or not. You see what happens is if you don’t have this methodology, when you get voicemail, automatically you say to yourself, “You know what? That’s it. I’m moving on.”

Michael: You could leave behind a great potential prospect.

Arrie: Yes, there’s where the numbers game comes from. It’s because there’s been no other ideas on how to handle this scenArrieo to go deeper in the call. People just hang up and call someone else. They’re like, “Well, it’s a numbers game.” I go, “No, it’s not.” The reason is because you don’t know a different way of handling it.

So, we have come up with a way to extract the information to identify where the person is. I could tell you there have been many instances where we’ve called in in our training scenArrieos with live sales people and the person is at their desk tying their shoe, and they missed the call.

Michael: Right. Do you have another technique on that?

Arrie: Well, we do. Along with leaving the voicemail, we teach people to basically leave on the voicemail what they would say on the cold call. So, in your case it would be, “Hi, my name is Michael. Maybe you can help me out for a moment. I’m just giving you a call to see if you’d be open to different ideas related to” – basically plug in your problem statement. You would not give a pitch about what you do.

So, we basically pour over what we come up with on the first call in to the voice mail, and those usually get more calls than the normal, “Hi my name is John. We offer this program. Give me a call back.”

Michael: Right. You say at the end, “If you’re interested, give me a call when you get a chance” Or “give me a call at any specific time.” How do you invite them to call you back?

Arrie: We just say, “If you’re open to some different ideas, give me a ring.” The whole idea here is to leave a message that is not pitchy, not salesly. That’s the whole idea here.

Michael: Right. What’s this “fight or flight reaction” about?

Arrie: Well, that relates to objections, and overcoming them. What happens is we’ve been taught when we get resistance to overcome it or to basically bail out – fight or flight.

What I’m saying is a third option. A third option is diffuse the moment, diffuse the pressure on the call, and level it so that it’s a two way battle and we can reengage again. That’s what we teach in the program.

Michael: How about the objection, “Send me more information” where it’s almost like a blow-off? How do you handle that?

Arrie: Well, I’ll tell you most people when they get that, they go, “Great”.

Michael: And, they send it.

Arrie: Then they call it and they start chasing that person down. They get their voicemail. They’re not there. Now, there’s a chasing game which is very painful for everybody.

What would you say would be three hidden agendas behind “send me information”?

Michael: Send me information is to get rid of you without having to reject you over the phone voice to voice.

Arrie: That’s one, yeah.

Michael: He may be interested, but just send it and he’ll have a look at it when he gets a chance.

Arrie: Exactly. He may be shopping around.

Michael: Yeah, that’s possible.

Arrie: But, what he didn’t say was maybe he really is interested.

Michael: Yeah, he could be.

Arrie: And, that’s something we don’t know.

Michael: See my mental programming that they just wanted to blow you off.

Arrie: That’s very common, and we expect that to happen. We don’t really know the truth. So, what we teach is to diffuse it and to reengage in a way to expose the truth.

So, what we say is if someone says, “Send me information”, we say, “That’s not a problem.”

Michael: Yeah.

Arrie: “That’s not a problem. I’ll be happy to send you what you might need. Can you help me understand specifically what issues are you trying to solve so I can customize what to send you?”

Michael: Oh, that’s good.

Arrie: Wouldn’t that make sense? So, we’re not forcing them to talk. We’re just saying wouldn’t it make sense to first understand what specifically you’re trying to deal with so I can know what to send you because logically it makes no sense. I might miss the mark.

Michael: Yeah, and if they’re not going to take the time to do it, it’s probably move on.

Arrie: Yes, it flushes it out.

For more details on these cold calling techniques  go to http://www.painfreecoldcalling.com

Michael: That’s good. All right. “Call me on Friday.” How about that?

Arrie: Oh yeah, a common blow-off. Sometimes, when you’re making a call to someone, “Give me a call on Friday”, and then guess what happens. They’re not there. But, we have created what we call a calendar relationship. It’s a concept that I’ve developed that’s very effective that you can use to book appointments with people in a non-aggressive way.

So, normally, if you’re on a call with someone, and it’s coming to an end, what you’d say is, “Well, great how about if we talk on Friday?” or “Talk next week.” And, they say, “Sure call me on Friday.” And, you hang up and they’re not there.

So, what we teach is the concept called a “calendar relationship”, and what you’d say is, “Would it make sense? Would it make sense for us to circle back and talk again another time and date than next week? So, we can really just reconnect again, and answer any questions you might have. That way we can not chase each other down, and just be on a calendar. Does that make sense at all?”

Michael: Okay, and you get them to agree on that.

Arrie: You get them to agree that it makes no sense for either you or me to chase each other down. So, it’s just common sense and a common respect for both people is all it is.

Michael: That’s great. How about when interested potential clients disappear? What’s this about?

Arrie: Oh, yeah, you probably had the time where you’re working with somebody who shows a lot of interest, and you go through the sales process with them. You meet them and you send information out, and it’s all looking good. Then, all of a sudden they disappear on you. They just don’t call you back.

How do you suppose most people handle that who have been schooled the old way? What do they typically do when they don’t get a call back?

Michael: They call back and say, “Hey, I haven’t heard from you.”

Arrie: That’s right.

Michael: “What’s the deal? You disappeared on me.”

Arrie: They keep chasing and they keep chasing, and that creates more what?

Michael: More stress and tension.

Arrie: More pressure. Do you see how we’ve been trained to pursue and not get to the truth?

Michael: Yes, absolutely we’ve been programmed.

Arrie: It’s just amazing how we hit our heads against the wall. I call that the chasing game, and if anyone listening to this call is chasing, I would just absolutely stop right away because there’s a different way of doing this that’s much more sane.

Michael: So, what do you do? Do you call the guy back?

Arrie: Well, you certainly call the person back, but you don’t call to say, “Hey, I’m calling to follow up.” You never used the word “follow up”. That’s another word we need to subtract from our language all together.

So, what you do is first of all, you have to understand, we want to get to the truth where the situation stands. So, what you do is you call back and you say, “Hi Jim. I’m not giving you a call to move the sales process forward.” That’s the first thing you say. So, imagine what the person is feeling or thinking about at that moment especially if you keep pushing, right?

But, instead you’re just using the pressure here. You’re taking the pressure off the scenArrieo. You say, “Look, I’m not calling to push this forward. I’m just calling to get some feedback. I haven’t heard back from you for a couple of weeks. So, I assume maybe you decided not to move forward which is fine. Not a problem with me. I was just calling to get some feedback to find out where I can improve.”

You’re basically saying, “Look, I know it’s probably over. You are saying it’s over, and I’m okay with that. I’m not going to pressure you for yes or no. All I’m looking for is the truth of where things stand.”

Why do you think prospects or people are afraid to tell the truth to sales people?

Michael: They don’t want to hurt their feelings. These cold calling techniques are great.

Arrie: Perfect. They don’t want to hurt their feelings, and they don’t want the person to be more aggressive with them to try to turn things around. There’s a fear of telling the truth with someone who sells.

So, what we do is we teach you to diffuse that suspicion to allow the other person to tell you the truth without him getting negative repercussions from you.

Michael: Now, with email, it sounds like these word scripts, these answers to objections can also come in the form of emails and direct mail. Are these effective through a letter and email as well?

Arrie: Very much so. We teach a whole module on what I call the written word which is email communication because I can’t tell you how many times people use email in the sales process and kill the deal just based upon their approach.

You’re absolutely right. We have the templates you can use and these words we’re talking about you can use as well in that email that does not come across as a sales pitch, and yes, this is all transferred across the email as well.

Michael: Sounds like you have some NeuroLinguistic Program designed into this, maybe unintentionally or intentionally.

Arrie: Well, definitely not intentionally because yeah it can be labeled that way, but I think the whole idea is we’re not trying to match or mirror anybody or try and persuade them or coerce them. What we’re trying to do is remove the tension that exists in the selling and buying relationship to allow the relationship to evolve naturally.

Michael: Let’s go over the actual product that you offer, the training itself. Can you describe what’s available if someone was interested to get the whole gamut of the training that you offer? How does it come? Is it on CD? Is it video? Give me details on what you have.

Arrie: What we’ve learned is that in order to change your mindset and shift over to this concept you have to have three modes of learning. One is the video, the visual. So, we have an online video. We ask you to watch this live training where I’m teaching how to do this way with a live, skeptical audience.

Michael: How long is that?

Arrie: Well, it’s about 45 minutes. Then, there’s the audio material which is the sequential, step by step concepts and wording to use that’s available which is about four hours or so of audio which comes online and on CD. Then, of course, there’s the written material which is also very important. That ebook form you print out, it’s all included in that master program.

We also have a coaching staff that works with you as part of the master program to work with you to really hone this to make sure this really sticks as a permanent way of being because I can’t tell you how many people who try to make this shift on their own without support end up going back to the old way because they’re so used to it.

Michael: Okay, so tell me about that support. You’ve got this master program, 45 minutes of video. You’ve got the ebook with all the word scripts and word packages transcribed out, and the four hours of audio on CD or you can listen online as well.

Arrie: Correct, and then along with that, you have access to call any of our coaching staff with questions you might have because people are going to need some help to develop the problem statements and the wording to use.

We actually already have wording by industry over the four years we’ve collected in our database. We have languaging to use for real estate, for insurance, for software, for marketing, for consulting, for coaches. We’re going to provide that to the folks who come on board.

Michael: Do you sell that in any of your packaging?

Arrie: It comes with the program.

Michael: So, all your word language for all the industries comes with the program?

Arrie: Yeah, in the program are some examples, and then we have more in our database. We keep adding more all the time. So, basically, you have full access to all of it.

Michael: I see. So, let’s say I’m in real estate, and I want all the objection handling related to my industry. How do I access that information online?

Arrie: Through your personal coach. We have different forms. We have documents. We have audio. Usually what happens in reality is people call and say, “I’ve got these two situations that I’m stuck on.” Because mostly they can be on their own. “I’m stuck here. How do I respond to this?” Or if I’m in real estate, I’m called For Sale By Owners at their home, “What should I say after this point?”

So, we had it all mapped out already.

Michael: How much coaching time to do I get?

Arrie: We may end up changing, but at the moment, they have access on a 90 day basis to the coaching staff, and at the moment, we haven’t restricted it because we trust people to use it in good faith. So, we haven’t had anybody take advantage of this yet. We leave it pretty much open. So, you can really call your coach as much as you need to to get this down.

Michael: For 90 days?

Arrie: That’s usually all they would need.

Michael: Okay, that’s pretty good. And, you’ve got two different programs. You’ve got the Mastery, and what’s the other one?

Arrie: And, the basic, and the basic is the materials on their own with no help at all from a human being.

Michael: Now, after 90 days, if I want additional coaching, what’s that going to cost me?

Arrie: It just depends. We’re happy to take a five, ten minute call. We’re not really strict about that. If you need an hour or so, we can bill it out. We have to adjust our rates based upon the situation, but it’s all customizeable. It’s all reasonable.

Michael: All right, very good. Let’s go to some frequently asked questions. How would you say this program is different from all the other selling programs? I know we talked about it, but let’s just recap.

Arrie: Well, it’s different because the mental focus is on diffusing the pressure and building trust with the person on the phone, and to break that 60 seconds down into a way that’s stress free and to be able to make the call and to build the conversation to really determine the truth whether there’s a fit there or not on the phone.

So, the way we’re different is that we don’t just tell you, “Think positive. Make the call, and get over your fear.” We show you exactly how to deliver it in a way that’s not scripted, but is natural and relaxed.

Michael: How do I know that it doesn’t contain a lot of these same old messages that I’ve heard from the sales gurus that you hear so much about?

Arrie: Because it’s the complete opposite of that. It’s the counter to the traditional way of thinking because we don’t teach, “Go make the sale.” We teach, “Go get the truth of whether there’s a fit there or not.”

So, by removing the assumption from your mind, you’re making a call to someone in a humble manner. You’re not assuming that what you have is for them.

See, the problem is the old way of thinking is you find a target market. You find someone to call, and you say to yourself, “Man, I’m going to get the appointment. I know I’m going to get it.” And, what happens is you’re mentally focused on that end goal, and the person feels that from you and they shut you down.

So, we release you from the end goal to allow you to have a natural engaging conversation to really let it evolve in a natural way to determine together if you’re a fit or not.

Michael: Now, can I get immediate results once I have a good idea how this system works?

Arrie: Absolutely. This is not something you have to memorize to do. This is something you can literally go online, order the program. Within four or five hours of studying the materials, you’ll make your own mental shift, and you’ll make a change. It will just be obvious to you. You’ll just realize things like the word “follow up” is a deadly word to use. You’ll stop using it right away. You’ll stop using the words, “Would you be interested?” I mean, these are immediate changes to use right away and you can get results right away.

Michael: Okay. How is this program different from prospecting programs that tell you to learn marketing from scratch and never cold call?

Arrie: Marketing is absolutely a legitimate thing to do. I do that. So, I’m not saying not to market. I’m just saying what most programs say is cold calling is dead. I agree. To cold call the old way absolutely is dead. You get rejected. It’s a hard way to go, but if you cold call the humane way, it’s a whole different world, and a much more relaxed manner.

So, I’m just saying a lot of people do not acknowledge this different way of doing it, and like you said earlier in this call, it’s almost free to make a phone call.

Michael: Absolutely. With this way and the power of talking to a person – a lot of these marketing programs out there with postcards and direct mail and all this other stuff in a lot of ways is all there because people want to avoid the pain of cold calling. Where if you just pick up the phone and call, you could be talking to your prospect right there instead of sending out lead generation pieces to have them call you. Do you see what I’m saying?

Arrie: Exactly.

Michael: Does this deal with the gatekeepers?

Arrie: Oh, very much so, yeah. There’s a whole methodology around gatekeepers. Any resistance that you get in the selling process is handled in the program.

Michael: This is very, very good. I think my listeners will be interested in this. You’re doing some great stuff. Arrie, thank you very much.

For more details on this cold calling system go www.PainFreeColdCalls.com or call Michael at 858-274-7851

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